Dental Practice Heroes

Escaping the Trap of Your Own Success

• Episode 618

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You have the income, the title, even a great team, but still feel trapped. Sound familiar? This episode with Dr. Richard Low will help you take a step back and understand what’s behind your burnout — and how to fix it.

We talk about his decision to leave his 35-office DSO to save his marriage and mental health, why isolation makes burnout worse, and what you can do to get out of the cycle of guilt and overwhelm. Tune in for much-needed advice and perspective on recovery, purpose, and finding yourself again!

Topics discussed:

  • Dr. Richard Low’s early success in dentistry
  • How success led to burnout, depression, and feeling trapped
  • The wake-up call that led him to leave his group
  • Why so many practice owners struggle to make a change
  • What to do when you’re unhappy in ownership
  • How to recover and heal from burnout
  • Why dentists need to talk more about mental health

Listen to the Next Level Dentist podcast: https://www.youtube.com/@NextLevelDentist

Connect with Dr. Richard Low:

https://nextlevelfathers.com/

https://www.instagram.com/dr.richard.low/

This episode was produced by Podcast Boutique https://www.podcastboutique.com




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Paul Etchison:

Have you ever felt trapped by your quote unquote success? Maybe sometimes you dread all the daily responsibilities of ownership, or you're completely burnt out and you're not sure where to even start to try to fix it. For this amazing interview, I brought Dr. Richard Lowe back on the show because he's been there, he gets it. He went from leading a 35-office group and giving it all up to save his marriage and his mental health. This is the stuff that we don't talk about in dentistry enough the pressure, the isolation, and what happens when you really start to feel like there's no way out when you're trapped. I mean, it's not a good place to be, but we're gonna talk about it today. You're gonna hear an amazing story about how Dr. Lowe rebuilt his life. He found a new path in dentistry, and he's helping practice owners overcome burnout, break their silence, and get healthy again. Man, I really love doing this episode and I love having him on. This was a great episode. Please listen to this one. I know you're gonna like it. You are listening to the Dental Practice Heroes podcast, where we teach dentists how to step back from the chair, empower their team, and build a practice that gives them their life back. I'm your host, Dr. Paul Etchison, dental coach, author of two books on dental practice management, and owner of a large four-doctor practice that runs with ease while I work just one clinical day a week. If you're ready for a practice that supports your life instead of consuming it, you're in the right place. My team of legendary dental coaches and I are here to guide you on your path from overwhelmed owner to dental practice hero. Let's get started. Hello and welcome back to the Dental Practice Heroes Podcast. I'm your host, Dr. Paul Edgeston. I'm really excited for my guest today, a good friend of mine, somebody I've known in the industry for a very long time. We got Dr. Richard Lowe on. He's the founder of Shared Practices. He's a longtime podcaster, former CEO of Shared Practices, many offices. He just started a new project called Next Level Father, and he's just kicking off a new podcast called Next Level Dentist, which, you know, talking about some of the deeper issues in dentistry, not clinical. We're talking about life stuff. So, Richard, welcome on, man. We're glad to have you back.

Richard Low:

Paul, like anytime we can talk is a good day. So, like, this is awesome. This is just fun. I'm really grateful and excited uh to be on the show with you.

Paul Etchison:

Love it, dude. So glad to have you. So let's just kick it off. Let's start about like just some backstory. If anyone hasn't heard, I don't know how they could not have heard of you, but if anyone hasn't heard of you, who is Richard Lowe? Like, what did you do in dentistry? What is your relationship to owning practices and all that good stuff that we'd like to talk about on podcasts?

Richard Low:

Sure. No, and I I will suspect a really good portion of your audience will have no clue I who I am because for the generation, my generation and younger, which is I started a podcast in 2016 called Shared Practices. And I decided actively I was a new grad. I had worked for Dental Town in dental school, and I wanted to start a podcast. I was like, no one older than me is gonna listen to me talk about practice ownership because I'm a new grad, I'm still in the army. So I'm just gonna say, you know what? I'm gonna serve me and younger, myself and younger. And it turned into very quickly, really gratefully, the the number one rated dental podcast in the industry because we just said, how do I know if practice ownership is right for me? And then how do I find, buy, and grow the right dental practice? And that was the hypothesis that kicked off our education business, it kicked off consulting, that led to our due diligence services, all of these things, because we decided I'm just gonna help this exact problem. How do I get into ownership? We biased towards acquisitions and we're gonna help people find the right practice to buy. And that's where it all started.

Paul Etchison:

Yeah, it's funny. Like share practices that started maybe a year and a half before I did, maybe just a year. And I watched you guys just like meteoric just rise. And I'm like, well, what's wrong with me? And then it's like, well, let that was it right there. You guys had a direction. You're like, hey, Paul, what's your podcast? I'm like, oh, dental business. Like, what do we do? I don't know. We just talk about dental business stuff. There's no mission statement. You know, there was just a jumbled mess of just randomness. And, you know, I feel like I've like narrowed it down now, but shit, I wish I would have had that kind of direction back then.

Richard Low:

Well, the one thing I always tell people is I've heard you rant, even in person, not on a podcast, not like scripted or anything like that, talking about helping your team like find purpose. Like I remember in dentistry and your manifesto, and like, I'm like, there's no one better than Paul at like creating meaning out of dentistry for your team and creating like a culture that's behind that. That's how I described your mission. I was like, Paul is so good at crafting deep meaning in what we do as dentists and getting your team to buy into that and building a very defined culture with a real clear like declaration of independence. That's how I've always seen what you've built. Oh, dude, that's so cool. That's awesome.

Paul Etchison:

I'm like, you're saying this. I'm like, yes, I guess I do. Yeah, yeah. Dude, I love that, man. So enough about me. Let's talk about you, man. So now you're kind of transitioned to this next level. You've been part of a lot of practices, sitting in the CEO seat, kind of managing businesses. You know, you had all this success that came with that. And I'm sure it's like from the outside, wow, look at that. Look at Richard Go. But talk about how did this translate into other areas of your life? And I think it's something a lot of dentists are going to be able to relate to.

Richard Low:

Yeah. So there was this moment where I got out of the army. We had built this podcast, this consulting company, and over the five years that I was still in the army, and I bought a denture practice that I turned into kind of a full arch uh practice, McCall's dentures, Ryan McCall from Dental Town, and added implants, added all on four. And some of my other uh partners and potential partners were doing similar things. And we all came together and said, you know what, I think we kind of have this special model that's halfway between clear choice and affordable, just offers the full menu. Whatever a patient needs, they walk in, we can help them. And we decided to form a group. And six of us merged, me and five other partners, we all merged our practices together. We refinanced our debt, we got some money to start opening denture and implant offices. And there was a really big part of me that was like, I'm worried I'm gonna hate this. And I had just actually walked away from a partnership of three practices that I bought with um GPS dental with Hunter Smith and Will Little, not Will Smith and Hunter Little. Um, but they were awesome. They were incredible partners, incredible people. Their GPS Dental is huge now, it's over 100 offices and amazing operators, and the doctors felt very cared for. But I just realized like every time my phone rang from the regional manager that was helping me manage these three practices, we managed them through COVID. I was still in the army. I was managing three offices through COVID, and I just hated it. I just dreaded everything that had to do with those three offices. And I was like, huh, I guess if you scale locations, you scale stress and headache and problems. And your problems just get bigger. Rather than having assistant hygienist problems, now you have doctor problems. And you think hygienists are hard to employ. Let me tell you, doctors, and you know, I'm sure all your doctors are perfect. Paul's never had a problem because his associates are listening to this.

Paul Etchison:

I feel like the specialists are even worse than the doctors. I feel like it just gets worse as you get more education.

Richard Low:

It's true. No, absolutely. So I had this strong sense going into this partnership of like, crap, I'm wondering if this is not going to fill my cup and I'm gonna regret this. But I also felt like I regretted if I didn't do it, would I regret that down the line? And so I jumped in and somehow found myself in the CEO role of this rapidly expanding group because I had started the podcast. So I used to joke with people. I started a podcast in my closet, and now somehow I'm the CEO of 35 offices.

Paul Etchison:

Yeah.

Richard Low:

And it just didn't make sense. And the reality was I was not doing well. I was really unhappy. I felt very trapped. I felt, I felt like a really crappy CEO, to be honest. I was great in meetings, I was great in person at trainings, but like I just wasn't coping well with the stress, with the liability, with the moves that needed to be made, managing teams and doctors and all of those things. I just felt trapped. I felt very, we're too far down the road. We opened 10 offices our first year, we opened 20 offices our second year. Absolutely insane growth and amazing doctors. We were doing amazing things, but I just couldn't take it. And my coping got worse and worse, and I didn't recognize myself. I felt like this isn't who I want to be. And the more time goes on, the more unhealthy my coping got, the more distant my marriage got, my relationship to God. And I just felt like I was getting crushed. So that is kind of what led me to almost losing my marriage. And I decided to step down. I stepped down as CEO, I stepped down as chief clinical officer, and said, Hey guys, I gotta figure things out. I gotta save my marriage, I gotta work on my mental health. I had some undiagnosed stuff and it got diagnosed. I was diagnosed with bipolar two, which is like not one of those like we understand ADHD, we understand autism, they make TV shows about dating on the spectrum. Like it's culturally very accepted, but bipolar is just kind of messier and and less well categorized. But I didn't realize I was depressed. And so I felt awful. It was really hard to step back from what I'd committed to do, you know, with my partners, from what our doctors were expecting of me, from just kind of the public shame of like feeling like I'd failed and crashed and burned. And I don't know. That's kind of how it got. It got pretty dark. It got pretty dark at times. And I feel like in dentistry we're not allowed to like admit that because everything looks so good on the surface. So I don't I don't know if you can relate to any of that.

Paul Etchison:

I think we're often, it's like you're the success story, you know. So you've got this almost image that you know we we want to portray. We hear it all the time. I want what you have. I want that's awesome. I want what you have. So then it's like there's this shame that comes with admitting that wow, it's it's not as great as you think it is. And I don't even know if it's what I thought it was gonna be. Speak to like the feeling of being trapped.

Richard Low:

It's interesting that you latched on to that word because I do think it's one of the most destructive emotions. Because when you don't feel like there's a way out, the walls just start closing in. And I've been working on kind of this operational definition of burnout, which is an exceeding of our capacity to bear stress over a sustained period of time to the point where our capacity begins to diminish. So it's like we've redlined it for so long. You can do something for six weeks, and you can do something for six months, maybe a year, but eventually things start to break. And as they start to break, our capacity gets worse and worse and worse. But there's this thing we tell ourselves of like, what else could I do? Like, I have to. Like, I have the practice, I have the house, we have the expectation, our kids are in these schools. We can't make any moves. This is the life we've built. And this is gonna be a weird thing to say, but we went to a couples therapy retreat in Switzerland last year, um, and it was something we were like looking forward to. Love it. Yeah. But that doctor, her name is Dr. Jennifer Finlay Sonfeif, she's kind of this LDS couples whisperer. But we talked about with her and with other people there, if you don't actually see divorce as an option, then you can't be truly choosing into the marriage. If it's like, oh, I have to stay with this person because we have the kids, because we have the history, because it would hurt too much, then essentially you're saying, I don't have any other choice but to stay with you. And therefore the decision to stay with you is out of obligation, not out of love. But as soon as that option truly is on the table of like, you know what, this might be awful, this might be really hard, this might be something that we don't want to do, but we will survive. If that were the choice, we would come out on the other side of it and hopefully we would make the most of it for ourselves, for our kids, for the situation, even if it was hard. I think the same thing is true with dental practice ownership. And I talked with a dentist like three weeks ago who is 400k upside down on his practice. Like he's got a practice that's worth 300,000, that he's got 700,000 worth of debt. And he's not a admittedly not a good operator, ADHD, get extremely overwhelmed, just can't lean into the business side of things, can't afford coaching, can't afford marketing, can't afford all these things. After looking at everything, I was like, you know what? Bankruptcy might actually be the right option. He's like, I was kind of that's where I'm headed. And here's the thing you might have to move, you might have to walk away from the practice, you might be embarrassed, but you're still gonna be able to pick up a handpiece somewhere and provide for your family. And it's not that extreme very often, but all of a sudden, as soon as things get bad enough, the choices actually open up. But all along the way, we assume I don't have any choices, I'm trapped, and it makes that burnout and that overwhelm worse.

Paul Etchison:

Well, it's interesting because as you're saying that, I'm seeing this in my own career of, like you said, man, and I've had periods where I'm like, man, it's just a busy few weeks, just got to get through these few weeks. This transition's happening at the practice. We're onboarding these people, we're having issues with this, with the maybe the front desk, and we're dealing with that right now. And then before you know it, you're like, man, it's been a busy few weeks nonstop for like three, four years. And for me, it's always been manifest itself as like irritability and just anger and just cynicism and just waking up and being like, This is shit. All this is shit, and I have nowhere to go, but everywhere I walk is shit. And it's interesting, your tolerance of it gets flashed. But there's you do feel trapped. And what I hear you saying is like almost that first step is acknowledging that you actually do have a choice, like you taking that power back and saying, I yeah, I don't want to close my practice, I don't want to sell my practice, I don't want to move on and do anything really big or drastic, but I still can. That's still an option. And I think you know, it's like everyone if they say we have to reach our rock bottom. I mean, everyone's rock bottom is very different. I think almost every rock bottom you find, you could logically find a worse rock bottom. It is almost infinite to how bad your life can get. I think it's just that rock bottom is that point where you decide to shift, you decide to make a change. So talk about like you went through this and you kind of reached your point and you realize that something needed to be done. I mean, was there a lot of pushback from I mean, your professional colleagues that you had at the at the practice? I mean, you started to say, I'm stepping away. Like it was, I mean, were they supportive or was there a lot of just like, come on, dude, let's go?

Richard Low:

I mean, I think when you work with people over time as partners, like they know when it's really not working. And I was not a great CEO. Like, yeah, they were carrying a lot of the load. Like, I remember my wife, she told me, I'm worried you're not living up to your side of the partnership and that your partners resent you because you're not doing your part. And in a lot of ways, you know, they didn't really express that and say those things in those words, but like deep down inside, I knew I wasn't functioning at the level that I wanted to and that I should have been in that partnership. And so they were understanding, like they understood that, like, okay, maybe this vision we had together is not your vision anymore. And who are they to say, like, no, we're gonna chain you to this and force you to do this? So Which would be a horrible move for them anyway.

Paul Etchison:

Yeah, it's the same thing, like it's like when you're I have an associate, and it's if they're talking about a past associate, but they're like, okay, I don't want to be here anymore. And I'm gonna hold them to a 90-day contract. Right. No. Like, go. Like, I don't want you here anymore either. If you don't want to be here, but it's like, yeah, you're probably right. They probably had some kind of sense, and I think you probably did the noble thing. It's like we've got to take care of ourselves first. So, what do you think? Like, someone's saying, like, you know what, I'm not in love with the reality that is my life right now. I'm not in love with my practice, I'm not in love with just the way I feel. I know so many dentists that have been through this stage of I'm here, I don't know how much I like it.

Richard Low:

Yeah.

Paul Etchison:

Speak to that. Like, what kind of outlook or words of wisdom could you offer to that person?

Richard Low:

Yeah. So, and I do want to say that in earlier saying, like, you need to consider all options, including not being a practice owner anymore or moving, changing all those things. Sometimes that's not the right answer. And it's like, maybe I just need to go to three days a week, or maybe I need to come in an hour later, or maybe I need to fire this toxic employee, or maybe I need to get systems in place and realize I need a real office manager, not just like a person I'm micromanaging and cleaning up behind them. So there's so many answers to what might be the answer. But the first thing that I would say is isolation is what makes this worse. You go to a conference, you talk with your dental classmates, and no one's talking about these things. Everyone's talking about the CE they're going to, the family trips they're going on, the success in their practice, the procedures they're doing. So then you just kind of like, who do I bring this crap up to? Who can I relate to? So I started a Facebook group called uh this Sonny from Dental Investment Group had brought up that, like, man, this group tends to not be the right space for people to bring up anxiety, depression, burnout type stuff. I wish it was, but it that's just not the vibe of the group. And so I was like, you know what? Okay, fine, I'm gonna finally start this. So I started a group called Next Level Dentist Rising Beyond Burnout, and was just like, hey, started having panic attacks this year. I've been through anxiety now and depression. I'd never like admitted to any of those things in the past, and there was just a flood of people coming in and joining. I have a hard time like getting people to participate, like post-anonymously, like share the hard stuff. Yeah, there has been a lot of that in the group, but finding a group of people that you can be truly vulnerable with about what's really going on, and sometimes it's what's really going on in your marriage, sometimes it's what's really going on spiritually, or with addictions, or with the unhealthy coping as a side effect of the stress, the financial fears and pressure and stressors. Because when we're all alone in this, it's hard for us to gain perspective. We tell ourselves a story about the situation, about what needs to be done, about the players involved, and we can't see it for what it really is. And so ending that isolation does those two things. Number one, immediate connection. I'm not alone. There's hope. These people have been through something similar and they've come out on the other side. And then number two, perspective of like, oh, maybe I'm looking at this in a way that's making it worse, or maybe there's options I haven't really considered. And so join the Facebook group if you feel like you are any of those, or just find your own community. It doesn't have to be a Facebook group, it doesn't have to be the men's group that I have next level fathers now, is this insane fitness accountability group that we do a lot. We talk about a lot of these things, but find your version of whatever that needs to be and end that isolation. The challenge is it's hard to do that in a church group setting because a lot of them are not entrepreneurs, they're not clinicians. It's hard to do that with family members. You know, just the other day I was talking with a dentist who opened up to his brother-in-law, who has like a handyman business of like his stressors and struggles and anxieties. His brother-in-law is like, what do you have to complain about? You are making so much money, you are XYZ. So that sense of like you open up and either a dentist like can't relate because their life's amazing, actually, not just on paper, or you open up to someone who's not a dentist, and they're like, How dare you complain? Your life is so good. And then you just learn to never open up again.

Paul Etchison:

Yeah, you learn like you're just an ungrateful POS that doesn't appreciate how glorious your life is. I always call these, these are my NDFs, my non-dentist friends. Yes. I can't share dentist problems with non-dentist friends. I just can't do it. And I've learned to shut my mouth up because it's one of those things. It's like they're working 40 hours a week, like someone like, you know, construction work. It's like their job is hard. And it's just like you can't bring that up. It's just, it's funny. But I I love how reaching out for the community, because that's been like something for me. And it's like, I'm not saying like you gotta have a 500-person community. I'm talking about like just a few people that you can share the stuff with and they understand where you're coming from. Four people. And it's like, it's one of those things that's so hard for I think people to realize the value in like reaching out for a coach or something. It's just you can't see it. You're too deep into it, you got too much bias. And also, it's we're all going through the same things. There's so much to be taught and learn each other.

Richard Low:

Yeah. It's funny, even for you now, having had coaches and you know, coaching and masterminds and you know, built another business, going through the DSO journey, all of those things, the more overlap, it's like our Venn diagram gets like more stupidly specific. And Paul's like, if Paul and I are talking on the phone like we did the other week, and we can talk about like building masterminds and podcasting and all these other things, then you can relate with another set of problems that even someone else might not be able to relate with. And so finding your people is just paramount. And the more alignment those people have, the better, which is ironically, so for me, I was at this utter low. And I went to a DEO conference in San Diego, and you know, they're they're kind of a mastermind for they were more for DSOs, now they're more doing uh single practice stuff as well. And Emmett Scott got up on stage, he was he was running the event, and he showed this transformation as before and after, he lost like 70 pounds. So it's like shirtless pictures before and after, and he had a six-pack, and he was like, you know, in his 40s, and he's like, I feel like I'm in the best shape of my life, my marriage has never been better, my energy with my kids, my confidence, my spiritual connection to God. And I was just in such a dark place that I was like, okay, I don't know what this is. Shut up and take my money, like the Futurama meme. Just like I am signing up. And so I signed up for this group called Superhuman Fathers. And I told the founder Kyle Carnahan, which he's coming on my podcast here shortly, it's a bait and switch. You get guys in with the abs. Like I had never been strong. I was not a collegiate athlete. I was not an athlete in high school, never had a six pack, but I was like, okay, maybe I can do this. And it ended up that the physical transformation was and seeing yourself in a new light physically, starting to respect yourself that you can do hard things was a catalyst to making other hard changes in my life, to creating a new identity in my marriage, in my spiritual walk, in my uh relationship with my kids, killing my demons and overcoming stuff. And so this men's group was that community for me of a bunch of broken men, but they weren't dentists. And that's where Next Level Fathers was born. Is I had I had had six months off to like save my marriage, figure out my mental health, and the bank account was like running low. It's like, I guess I better do something, otherwise, money's gonna run out. So I was like, I'll either buy a dental practice or let's start this group and see if I can make this my full-time focus. And now a year later, we're about to hit a year November 1st. We've got about 40 guys in the group. We've lost over 900 pounds as a group. We just did our in-person retreat, our first couple's retreat and our first men's retreat. And the transformation these guys have had, like, it felt like hanging out with 13 of your best friends for a weekend on the retreat. And guys like working through major addictions, major issues in their marriages. So that right there is this weird journey of like, somehow now I'm a personal trainer, fitness influencer for dentists who talks about burnout and runs a men's group. And I never thought my life would ever look like this.

Paul Etchison:

Have you ever met anyone with that same title ever?

Richard Low:

No. Yeah, like I tell people what I do, and they're like, wow, that is stupidly niche. And I'm like, I agree. Like, how did we get here?

Paul Etchison:

Well, you know, like, okay, so your your money's going out in the bank and you're thinking about like what changes you're making, you're starting to see some progress and gain some momentum. Talk about the decision to really lean into this versus, well, I know dental practice. Let's jump back into dentistry. Like, was that a tough decision?

Richard Low:

It's funny because it goes back to that, like, once you've done practice ownership and you've had success at it, especially podcasting about it for nine years, and just having done enough clinical dentistry, I was like, worst case scenario, I'll just go back and pick up some clinical days, or I'll buy a practice and I'll do it. So people feel so trapped by dentistry, they feel so trapped by like, I have to spin a handpiece because this is where I make the most money. I've changed how I feel about that of like, it's a great safety net. You can always do it part-time, you can always go back to it. And my entire life, adult life, has been me overcommitted. It's been four jobs in undergrad. I got my real estate license in dental school. I worked for dental town in dental school. I started the podcast while I was in the army and then owned practices while I was in the army. And I think part of the problem was I've always been overcommitted. I've always been doing too much at once. And so I felt so passionate about this group and this concept that I was like, I'm willing to burn through savings and kind of pour into this because if I can save a man from himself and his darkness, like it's just more fulfilling than an MOD or an all-on-for. Like it just is for me at this point. So true.

Paul Etchison:

How do you prevent yourself from overcommitting into this new endeavor? How do you how do you halt that pattern from taking over this part of your new career? I suppose.

Richard Low:

That's a great question. I think it's hard actually right now because a lot of I'm asking for a friend, not for myself. Right, right, right. Like a lot of my life is like I'm talking with dentists on social media and like the conversations, there's always like DMs kind of pinging in the background when I'm trying to be with my family. I think there is this like, okay, hard boundaries. I've put apps and things on my phone that actually have been really helpful. Opal is my favorite. Uh, there's another one called Brick, where it just like shuts things off at certain times, and you can't even unlock it. So I can go to my computer and get to Facebook or Instagram, but as of a certain time at night, I can't disable it. It will turn off those apps, and I can't gain access to them. But more importantly, I think is I've drank the hormosy Kool-Aid recently, and he just yells, he does these in-person events in Vegas where these entrepreneurs come. He just yells at people all day long about like, just have one business. Like, don't have a second business, don't have a third business. You just went, right? Did you just go to a thing?

Paul Etchison:

I think we were talking.

Richard Low:

I didn't go. I went to the live webinar and I bought like the $6,000 package from that. But which was been awesome. His AI.

Paul Etchison:

Sorry, I cut you off. Like, continue that story. I wish we should have it as well. Yeah.

Richard Low:

No, no, no. It's great. So not committing to another business is the biggest thing for me right now. I am not going to do both practice ownership and this. I'm not going to start another offer. I just feel like there's so much to do in this lane that to pull my attention anywhere would be a distraction.

Paul Etchison:

Yeah, that's so true. And it's funny you mentioned hormose because I was recently on the West Coast watching uh just a Hermosy just YouTube channel. And it was a talk he gave, and it made me think, man, that day I go to the dental practice once a week, that is a distraction from what I'm truly passionate about. And I don't, my team listens to this, so they're gonna say, Oh, he's not passionate about the office. I, you know, I love the office, I love you girls, like you guys are awesome. But it's like I'm so passionate about like this this podcast journey and the coaching journey. And I told my leads the other day to say, I want to be the guy that shows up on Tuesday and just does five hours of ortho, and that's all I am. And they're like, Well, that's all you are. I'm like, but I'm not when you guys are reaching out to me for this and that and that, and you're bringing me into like telling me this practice needs more you. Like, I can't give more to the practice. So I could totally see how you finally zeroed in on this, and man, what a difference you're making for people. I mean, that's gotta be so like satisfying.

Richard Low:

It's so fun, and it's also like it's so ridiculous how even our retreat, we I hired a fitness photographer, and so it was like the after photos, they're they are unreleased as of this moment, but like these guys got jacked, and some of them got waxed and spray tanned, and like they just look phenomenal. But it was like one of those like we're all doing something kind of like stupid together, yeah, yeah. That we laughed about and uh we'll look back on fondly. But you're talking about what you're passionate about, and and actually, yesterday I launched a new podcast. So, you know, launched a podcast, shared practices. Yeah, talk about that. You know, nine years ago almost uh to the month, pretty close. And this is like my first next thing that I've been this excited about since then. Okay. So the name of the podcast is next level dentist. And the hypothesis is everyone thinks that next level is another practice, another CE course, another CERAC machine, another million dollars, like whatever. That is. Like what I'm driving for and what's next. And the reality is we've overinvested in our identity as a dentist. And we've divested from oftentimes our family were more disconnected. You know, Christine and I were sleeping in separate beds and we felt like roommates at times. And I was not as present with my kids as I wanted to be. And reinvesting in ourselves, in all of the other areas of our life that matter is something you have to be intentional about. And I've seen two patterns, and I've seen two types of dentists that I really connect with. One is the successful dentist who's saying, now what? Like I'm still kind of empty feeling, I'm still kind of itchy feeling, I'm still unfulfilled. And I'm, what's my next thing? What am I? Am I going to open another practice? Am I going to build another business? Now what? And that person oftentimes ends up doing things very similar to the burnt out, crushed dentist who just feels overwhelmed, who feels trapped. We tend to cope with existential crises of like, I have more money than I thought I ever would, and I still am not happy, in the same way of I'm burnt out and miserable and stuck and very unhappy. So those are the two extremes that I'm kind of talking to on this podcast. And it's kind of the post practice ownership podcast. It's like you own a practice, here's one of the two gifts. You either have success and an itch to do something else, or you're crushed and getting burned out. And sure, there's people in the middle, but who are fulfilled and happy and they're not going to listen to my podcast. That's fine. But I also want to talk about some of the really hard stuff to talk about. So our first season is on suicide and dentistry. And we've seen, I feel like this summer I've seen like three or four colleagues that have taken their lives. And there's been a lot of guys who've been in dark places before joining my group and who've been going through really hard things. And so I'm trying to understand this because this comes up. Like I called my mentor Kyle Carnahan when one of the guys joined my group and was in a really bad spot. I was like, okay, Kyle, if I'm worried about a guy committing suicide, what do I do? And I have he's coming on the podcast. Kyle is unfiltered and insane. So if you listen to that episode, there's gonna be like 20 trigger warnings before you listen to the episode. But he was a firefighter and he literally saw the aftermath of suicide, you know, walking in on the scenes, and then he's helped hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of men in that place. And his first question was does he have a plan? Because if he doesn't have a plan, then it's kind of a cry for help, but he's he's not in that danger zone. But if he has a specific plan, it's kind of another level. And so I want to bring light to this so that people can talk about this who they've like considered walking through that door, and that door is just kind of looming, you know, of like, oh, they've thought about that option. Um, and when things get dark, that option kind of presents itself again. And to be able to talk about that, to be able to prevent that, to be able to grieve when it does happen and understand and and forgive ourselves and forgive others when we feel like, oh, I could have done something. And I want to talk about the hard things. And it's not always gonna be this heavy or or difficult on the podcast. But season one, we're gonna start with this, and then we're gonna go with success. Success in now what? And I'm gonna talk with a bunch of different dentists who've sold to a DSO or built multiple practices or struggled and and kind of hit it or you know, different things like that. But this is the stuff that I'm I feel really passionate about these days.

Paul Etchison:

I love that, man. And one thing that stood out, what you just said, and like what I put together from it, is that do you have a plan? If anyone's listening, like, do you have a plan? Because if you don't have a plan, I mean, essentially what I'm hearing is there is no hope for the future. That's what that feels like. But once you get a plan, you're moving towards something. So all that thing that sucks, you can kind of not that we, you know, we always say live in the present, don't live in the future, but there's some element of us that I truly believe needs to be living into the future for a better version of yourself right now. And I I think that's uh speaks to that hopelessness. Like there is no plan. I have no options. I am trapped. We'll come back to that. And I think we just went full circle there. But but man, dude, Richard, always great to talk to you, man. I I love talking to you and talking to you off the air as well. And um, I'm so excited for your project, dude. I can't wait to listen to it. I'm really excited to hear what you do with this. I think your new journey, your goal, your missions, it's so good and it's so needed. And I just really I just love you, man. I love everything you're doing. So it's so cool to have you on the podcast and just can't wait to hear what you do going forward, man. So thanks for coming on.

Richard Low:

Paul, this is awesome. This is a lot of fun. Thank you. And I'm I'm always grateful. Like, literally, I smile if I ever see a text or a phone call from Paul. So thank you, man.

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Dr. Paul Etchison

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